Nepal says Indian INSAS riffles let it down in rebel battle

[indianguy4u]

Then ask them why has Op Topac (Zia's plan for Kashmir) failed in phase II?...

Sir i was talking of the recent incident in srinagar, when few journos were also injured. What i saw was utter panic. No proper plan to counter the pigs who were holed up in a hotel & other a few blocks away.

I have a Q, why doent IA have full time snipers at strategic location all over srinagar. It wont cost too much .

[lemontree]

Sir i was talking of the recent incident in srinagar, when few journos were also injured. What i saw was utter panic. No proper plan to counter the pigs who were holed up in a hotel & other a few blocks away.

You have to understand that urban fighting is a difficult ball game. The security agencies follow their laid down drills in such situations, and clearing a terrorist holed up in a building takes time. It would be simipler to fire a rocket launcher in the rooms and blow it up. But then the "bleeding hearts" brigade would be up in arms for the "execissive" use of force against terrorists, besides the blast could kill or injure innocent civilians.

I have a Q, why doent IA have full time snipers at strategic location all over srinagar. It wont cost too much .

It is not possible to put soldiers everywhere.

[cottage cheese]

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[cottage cheese]

Its just a heavier barrel version and shorter in length. But not much fun to fire. The original Belgian auto SLRs are much better (the BSF is issued with these, 1 per section).

Yes I'd checked out the Belgian FALs - beautiful piece. The CRPF uses a few as well. I didn't know it was on per section basis.

In the army we say that if you get stuck in an ambush in J&K you can escape but in the NE even God can't save you.

:) haha - Well, being a Naga myself I find myself pretty amused by the statement. I can tell you one thing, they choose the Ambush sites very well (I'd inspected some "historical" ambush sites not just in Nagaland but other states as well), but again the guerillas are just human and just as frightened and excited as anyone else. They only had the advantage of throwing the first punch. It was and is my belief that, tables can be turned using proper procedure. Level headed field leadership and of course properly tutored troops and effective weapons. Of late, I've observed very professional movement and SFP's by the military, I guess we've learnt from the past (Finally!)- and of course they're a whole lot more polite nowdays :)

The UBL or GL is a section weapon, while a 2" mor is a platoon weapon. The GL seems to be on its way out and the UBL may get inducted, till then one has to use the GL at the rifle section level.

Yeah, I'd seen some of those revolving GLs in JK, I hope UBGLS are going to be inducted too, since the revolving type will probably require a dedicated bloke who will be useless once he's popped off all his G's. A UBGL person still has his basic weapon to continue fighting. Hell, I'd seen a soldiers on sniffer-dog patrols (Platoon strength) lugging 84mm Carl Gustafs!

That is because of the predictability factor. It will always happen, troops going cross country rarely get ambushed.

Yup- you're right there. I've rarely heard of a foot patrol being successfully ambushed. Even in motorized movement, it's only recently that I'd observed good spacing of vehicles. Earlier it used to be bunched up in a complete goose f**k, providing small saturated killing zones for the ambushers. Now of course with wide dispersal of vehicles the ambushers are forced to stretch their killing zone at the cost of concentrated fire arcs. They also have the Casspir now, so explosive initiated ambushes are, as I assume, rendered less effective.

As you mentioned to indianguy4u urban warfare is a pain- one that cannot be mastered with conventional tactics. Collateral damage (human and material) is a handicap, not to mention the stupid bleeding heart liberal farts, who are a cancer almost as bad as the terrorists. Here, I'll comment less since you're the one with first hand experience.

[ArjunMK1]

Nepalis fared badly when they were equipped with M16s and FN FALs .

It training that matters, not the firearms.

[lemontree]

:) haha - Well, being a Naga myself I find myself pretty amused by the statement. I can tell you one thing, they choose the Ambush sites very well [I](I'd inspected some "historical" ambush sites not just in Nagaland but other states as well),

Ukrul and Mokokchung should have many of these sites.

It was and is my belief that, tables can be turned using proper procedure. Level headed field leadership and of course properly tutored troops and effective weapons. Of late, I've observed very professional movement and SFP's by the military,

Its all in the training.

I guess we've learnt from the past (Finally!)- and of course they're a whole lot more polite nowdays :)

Again its all in the training and the officers. My fathers era use to burn the nearest village near and ambush site (old colonial tactics). My era develops intelligence. Besides we have a better understanding of insurgency than our fathers. For example, if your neighbour is a UG, and even though you do not agree to his way of life you would not want to harm him (he may have studied with you in school for all I now). Now it does not make sense to torture you for info on the UG, it will only turn you to take up arms, and then instead on one I will have two UGs to worry about.

Hell, I'd seen a soldiers on sniffer-dog patrols (Platoon strength) lugging 84mm Carl Gustafs!

These are the best, in an ambush just aim at the undergrowth and bang. Then there is silence. :)

[cottage cheese]

Ukrul and Mokokchung should have many of these sites.

Yeah, I'm originally from Mokokchung - Ideal ambush country.
Hey lemontree, since you're the one with actual field experience, how useful would a sniper be for a platoon strength foot patrol an ambush in Mokokchung type terrain?
Often I'd observed a guy or two with Dragunovs minus the PSO1 scopes- just open tangent sights, on such patrols.

These are the best, in an ambush just aim at the undergrowth and bang. Then there is silence. :)

Yup- Maybe we should've loaded 4 -5 KGS of buckshot for the 84MMs - The ultimate Shotgun! :)

[lemontree]

Yeah, I'm originally from Mokokchung - Ideal ambush country.

Are you an Ao?

Hey lemontree, since you're the one with actual field experience, how useful would a sniper be for a platoon strength foot patrol an ambush in Mokokchung type terrain?
Often I'd observed a guy or two with Dragunovs minus the PSO1 scopes- just open tangent sights, on such patrols.

Snipers are of no use in counter-ambush IMO. Thermal devices are best to detect ambushes.
We have an ex-US army sniper here in WAB - M21sniper, and he will give a better response since it was his trade.

[cottage cheese]

Are you an Ao?

Snipers are of no use in counter-ambush IMO. Thermal devices are best to detect ambushes.
We have an ex-US army sniper here in WAB - M21sniper, and he will give a better response since it was his trade.

Yup , Ao as Ao can be :)

About the snipers, yes, I also thought it was kind of odd having them in a volume fire situation.

I'll get M21 on this.... hang on.

[lemontree]

Yup , Ao as Ao can be :)

Do you hsppen to know Temzu Ao or Tinu Ao? They ex-Naga Regt officers.

[cottage cheese]

Do you hsppen to know Temzu Ao or Tinu Ao? They ex-Naga Regt officers.

Pretty common names - We Aos are pretty unimaginative when it comes to names. We now have a shortage of names!!

Temsü Ao form Shillong? Longkumer perhaps? I know one who got into the TA some years ago.

Tinu - is he an old timer? Coz we have a couple of my village clan with the same name who were in the Army. In fact an uncle of mine was (I think) the first Ao in the Paras - he was killed by the UG when he came home for leave back in the 60's

Well well....small world eh? :)

[lemontree]

Pretty common names - We Aos are pretty unimaginative when it comes to names. We now have a shortage of names!!

Temsü Ao form Shillong? Longkumer perhaps? I know one who got into the TA some years ago.

Tinu - is he an old timer? Coz we have a couple of my village clan with the same name who were in the Army. In fact an uncle of mine was (I think) the first Ao in the Paras - he was killed by the UG when he came home for leave back in the 60's

Well well....small world eh? :)

Well the ones I named are all old timers retired now, In fact Col. Temzu Ao is suffering from lung cancer, he met us when he came to Bombay (this year) for his treatment.
Col. P Tinu Ao, lives in Mokochung, somewhere near the post office.

[cottage cheese]

Well the ones I named are all old timers retired now, In fact Col. Temzu Ao is suffering from lung cancer, he met us when he came to Bombay (this year) for his treatment.
Col. P Tinu Ao, lives in Mokochung, somewhere near the post office.

I seem to know them both. Col. Temsu is kind of related so is Col. Tinu. Haven't met in ages. If I have the suffix to their names, I'll know for sure. :)

[lemontree]

I seem to know them both. Col. Temsu is kind of related so is Col. Tinu. Haven't met in ages. If I have the suffix to their names, I'll know for sure. :)

:) Small world. To be sure, if you meet them ask if they know "Kenny" (my old man), besides if they are ex-Naga Regt. then it is them. Convey my regards and you will get to know my name from them too. :)

[cottage cheese]

:) Small world. To be sure, if you meet them ask if they know "Kenny" (my old man), besides if they are ex-Naga Regt. then it is them. Convey my regards and you will get to know my name from them too. :)

pretty cool eh?- nepal to mokokchung! I'm returning home in September - maybe I'll pop into mokokchung then. the circle will be complete then.